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	<title>Comments on: Life without a state is dominated by custom</title>
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	<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/</link>
	<description>From the ancient Greek for equality in freedom of speech; an eclectic mix of thoughts, large and small</description>
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		<title>By: Longarch</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3660100</link>
		<dc:creator>Longarch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Mar 2024 18:41:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3660100</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[“Simply showing some rain, as if it were an unalloyed good, misses half the story.”

I had missed that point. Thanks for explaining. I stand corrected.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“Simply showing some rain, as if it were an unalloyed good, misses half the story.”</p>
<p>I had missed that point. Thanks for explaining. I stand corrected.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Phileas Frogg</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3659806</link>
		<dc:creator>Phileas Frogg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Mar 2024 19:21:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3659806</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Medieval Europe was the domination of the State by Custom and Society, Modern Europe is the domination of Custom and Society by the State; early and contemporary America followed an identical trajectory over a much shorter span, and the Internet will soon follow on an even shorter timeline.

In each instance the formal overcomes the informal, until it overcomes itself.

The greatest enemy of a successful State, is the success of the State.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Medieval Europe was the domination of the State by Custom and Society, Modern Europe is the domination of Custom and Society by the State; early and contemporary America followed an identical trajectory over a much shorter span, and the Internet will soon follow on an even shorter timeline.</p>
<p>In each instance the formal overcomes the informal, until it overcomes itself.</p>
<p>The greatest enemy of a successful State, is the success of the State.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Gwern</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3659782</link>
		<dc:creator>Gwern</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Mar 2024 18:06:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3659782</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;…it just took them a long time, and Lynch did not want to try to convey that length of time.&quot;

That&#039;s not the problem. One could just handwave it with a time-skip or invoke future tech to deal with the plausibility problem of terraforming happening that fast. The “tragedy” referred to is that the Fremen culture was the result of their environment.

So greening Arrakis means, in addition to destroying the supply of spice, the inevitable and predictable destruction of the Fremen culture. In &lt;a href=&quot;https://amzn.to/4355vmn&quot;&gt;Dune Messiah&lt;/a&gt;, the Fremen have become corrupt greedy venal urbanized theocrats ruling their new empire, and by the time of &lt;a href=&quot;https://amzn.to/3wF7PnT&quot;&gt;God Emperor of Dune&lt;/a&gt;, the success of the terraforming has reduced them to literally “museum Fremens” LARPing their &lt;em&gt;Dune&lt;/em&gt; ancestors for tourists.

Simply showing some rain, as if it were an unalloyed good, misses half the story.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;…it just took them a long time, and Lynch did not want to try to convey that length of time.&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s not the problem. One could just handwave it with a time-skip or invoke future tech to deal with the plausibility problem of terraforming happening that fast. The “tragedy” referred to is that the Fremen culture was the result of their environment.</p>
<p>So greening Arrakis means, in addition to destroying the supply of spice, the inevitable and predictable destruction of the Fremen culture. In <a href="https://amzn.to/4355vmn">Dune Messiah</a>, the Fremen have become corrupt greedy venal urbanized theocrats ruling their new empire, and by the time of <a href="https://amzn.to/3wF7PnT">God Emperor of Dune</a>, the success of the terraforming has reduced them to literally “museum Fremens” LARPing their <em>Dune</em> ancestors for tourists.</p>
<p>Simply showing some rain, as if it were an unalloyed good, misses half the story.</p>
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		<title>By: McChuck</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3659631</link>
		<dc:creator>McChuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Mar 2024 13:04:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3659631</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;em&gt;Dune&lt;/em&gt; is &lt;em&gt;Lawrence of Arabia&lt;/em&gt; in space.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>Dune</em> is <em>Lawrence of Arabia</em> in space.</p>
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		<title>By: Longarch</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3659554</link>
		<dc:creator>Longarch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Mar 2024 08:55:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3659554</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[“This is why David Lynch’s 1984 adaptation fails. In that adaption Paul really is the promised one: his victory makes it rain on Arrakis. There is no sense of the tragedy that inevitably accompanies a fulfilled prophecy.”

Lynch&#039;s adaptation was trying to cover a lot of ground in a limited amount of time.  Although Paul did not make it rain in the book as he did in Lynch&#039;s movie, the Atreides family really did terraform Arrakis — it just took them a long time, and Lynch did not want to try to convey that length of time.  

I would argue that Paul was indeed a chosen one, but the nature of a &quot;chosen one&quot; is more vague than Koyama wants to believe.  Power is not the same as ethical sophistication or moral justification.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>“This is why David Lynch’s 1984 adaptation fails. In that adaption Paul really is the promised one: his victory makes it rain on Arrakis. There is no sense of the tragedy that inevitably accompanies a fulfilled prophecy.”</p>
<p>Lynch&#8217;s adaptation was trying to cover a lot of ground in a limited amount of time.  Although Paul did not make it rain in the book as he did in Lynch&#8217;s movie, the Atreides family really did terraform Arrakis — it just took them a long time, and Lynch did not want to try to convey that length of time.  </p>
<p>I would argue that Paul was indeed a chosen one, but the nature of a &#8220;chosen one&#8221; is more vague than Koyama wants to believe.  Power is not the same as ethical sophistication or moral justification.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3659468</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Mar 2024 03:23:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3659468</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Villeneuve&#039;s casting is a crime against humanity.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Villeneuve&#8217;s casting is a crime against humanity.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Bruce</title>
		<link>https://www.isegoria.net/2024/03/life-without-a-state-is-dominated-by-custom/comment-page-1/#comment-3659444</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Mar 2024 00:32:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.isegoria.net/?p=51506#comment-3659444</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jerry Pournelle and Larry Niven in &lt;a href=&quot;https://amzn.to/42ZplPL&quot;&gt;Oath of Fealty&lt;/a&gt; wanted a society that favored custom over law. 

When I read Frank Herbert, I keep seeing madly romantic premises — a sentient star that likes S+M, a Captain from Castile in space, a spy trying to overthrow a hive of human insects — crammed into the 1950&#039;s trope of smart nervous professionals doing something dangerous and complicated while terrified of their genius boss.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jerry Pournelle and Larry Niven in <a href="https://amzn.to/42ZplPL">Oath of Fealty</a> wanted a society that favored custom over law. </p>
<p>When I read Frank Herbert, I keep seeing madly romantic premises — a sentient star that likes S+M, a Captain from Castile in space, a spy trying to overthrow a hive of human insects — crammed into the 1950&#8242;s trope of smart nervous professionals doing something dangerous and complicated while terrified of their genius boss.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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