It’s all equally illogical, in terms of belief. The religious believe as a matter of faith; the source of that faith is the received wisdom they gathered in from their elders and society. Hardly anyone out there has experienced the supernatural aspect of religious belief; those who have, are arguably mistaken and/or deluded, thinking the voices in their heads are those of God and/or the angels. I’m not gonna render a verdict on that, but the fact is, I’ve never experienced anything that would either point to or reinforce the religious teachings I had as a kid. It’s all faith; all the way down.

Similarly, the Left? LOL… They’re more like the people they disdain and mock, oblivious to the fact that the belief system they follow is equally evidence-free. You can’t point to a single large- or small-scale example of socialism working. But, they still believe in it, ignoring the failures, insisting that it will only take proper implementation to work. Empirical evidence to the contrary.

The majority of Leftist thought is purest faith-based bullshit. The Marxist canon is full of theories that don’t work, but it is studied as though it were the writ of some bearded god, delivered by one of his prophets. You can’t even discuss anything with the majority of adherents; they block you out, precisely as the most fervent Southern Baptists will when you bring up issues of their faith.

It’s well past time to start evaluating Leftism as either a religion or mental illness; it ceased being a political/philosophical issue decades ago.

NOT merely organized but any religion period. Atheists most of them. A pretty good number of them despise religion in any form, Christianity especially. Unless to say JESUS was the first communist.

You evidently have not been attending service. For a return to moral rectitude, I suggest a few weeks with the Good Bishop Stephen Colbert.

Shareholders don’t hold enough of a stake in these enterprises to care when the government apparatchiks mandate some unworkable BS like the home loan programs of the Clinton era. So, they don’t object, riding the plane into the ground. No skin in the game, really. Responsibility and power to do anything has become diffuse and disconnected from reality.

This is a logical consequence of, for example, the hedge fund: nanoscopic slivers of ownership spread out across as many entities as is practically feasible. For shareholders to exercise legitimate authority over an enterprise, they must be compelled to possess a stake sufficiently large for them to care, in enterprises few enough that they are capable of caring about.

I am not so sure it matters whether either side or both is ignoring the corporate structure of the other side’s media, or whether there is or is not any difference between being suspicious of the Koch Brothers and of Soros. [I would think it worthwhile to be suspicious of both considering where the Koch bros fall on some issues.]

The whole ‘fake news’ and ignorance of Republican voters paradigm really depends on the left believing their vision of the world and of their country is the only possible one, therefore their goals are the only possible ones, all others are illegitimate, therefore if you believe stories or pursue policies that contradict those you are either a villain, an idiot, or being manipulated. They are actually generous to so often assume mere idiocy. Kind of them, really.

So contradictions like -”you are stupid for believing Alex Jones” versus “I was intelligent for believing fringe Democratic netroots in the 2000s” or “I was smart to oppose confrontational policies against the RUssians in the 1980s” but “you are stupid to oppose confrontational policies against the Russians” seem to fly completely under the radar.

There’s near complete disconnect of goals and expectations as well as of information.

The truth of the matter is that we have backed ourselves into what amounts to a more-than-slightly Fascist economy, mostly in an absence of thought. Shareholders don’t hold enough of a stake in these enterprises to care when the government apparatchiks mandate some unworkable BS like the home loan programs of the Clinton era. So, they don’t object, riding the plane into the ground. No skin in the game, really. Responsibility and power to do anything has become diffuse and disconnected from reality. So, nothing gets fixed until it is unrepairable with a minor adjustment.

And, of course, the heavy hand of the State looms in the background, thumb on the scales, picking winners and losers based on the political whims and fads of the moment. Fascist.

I’ve become convinced that modern, public corporations are pretty much “owned” by their employees.

Owners call the shots. Owners get the bennys. Owners get the shaft when things go south.

Stockholders? What individual stockholders there are don’t have any power. Funds like Vanguard, etc. make up most of the stock owners. In effect, stockholders lease the stock, hoping for a gain. The funds (and individuals) don’t have the time and expertise to call any shots. If they don’t like what the company is doing, they bail.

Follow the money. Where do revenues go? Doesn’t it make sense that $ would go to “owners”?

Employees make a *lot* more $ than stockholders.

Various governments might get more $ than stockholders. And governments probably have a *lot* more say in what a company does than stockholders. So, if you’re looking for who else has “ownership” of corporations after employees, governments are a good candidate. (BTW, it might be argued that governments are “owned” by their employees, too.)

And when things go south, it’s the employees who feel it most. The Black Rocks of the world eat 0.001% of their wealth and move on.

I’d frame that as being more that the Left requires a narrative, regardless of whether it is true, and the Right is mostly dependent on facts.

There is a certain immaturity to most of the people I know who profess to Left-ward belief systems; they must have their Story, their narratives, and anything that stands contrary to it is to be ignored or attacked.

The Right-ish folks, on the other hand? They fail to realize the power of the narrative to persuade the median, and rely on what they perceive as self-evident facts.

I think it’s a function of my long-held belief that every human being requires a certain amount of irrational belief, or they cannot function. On the right, that need is met (mostly) by organized religion. Since many on the Left have abandoned organized religion in any serious way, they have had to substitute more and more bizarre irrationalities in substitute. My favorite one, I think, was the vehement atheist who was also a fervent believer in the healing benefits of certain specific crystals…

A lot of what passes for Left-wing politics can be analyzed as a substitute religion, the facts of which are taken on as a matter of faith, and held to with similar vigor. It’s scary how much irrational and rigid belief a lot of these folks actually have in their politics. An acquaintance of mine was railing on and on about corruption in local government, based on the (mistaken) belief that the perpetrator was a Republican. Two minutes with the phone, and I’m showing him the actual party affiliation. Instant switch to “Oh, I’m sure it’s all a misunderstanding…”. And, what was truly amazing was my observation that the whole thing was like watching a switch being flipped in his head.

I’m telling you, if we start doing the Turing test on a lot of humans, Graham is gonna be super-disappointed at how few actually pass the damn thing…

Me? I’m probably going to be amazed at how many pass. Human stupidity and fecklessness may be the only thing really infinite in this universe of ours.

The left instead have a culture of hate that makes them proselytise everyone.

I really don’t see a lot of effect resulting from how we’re doing “corporate governance”, because the shareholders don’t seem to be exerting all that much influence on the direction of the corporations they supposedly “own”. If they did, then you wouldn’t see the crap we have going on in the media industry, with all the gratuitous waste on propaganda films that never make their money back.

Investors don’t seem to get really pissed-off enough to actually do anything, until and unless they’re staring bankruptcy in the face–And, even then? It’s like most of them are someone in steerage trying to warn the captain of the Titanic that maybe slowing down a little would be a good idea…

We do corporations and big government entirely wrong, in my opinion. We set up these huge bureaucracies that are all too prone to being captured by interests inimical to long-term success, and then when it all crashes and burns, we’re sitting there in the wreckage and going “What happened…?”. Harvey Weinstein should have been a known quantity, and reined in enough to prevent that whole hubristic disaster from happening. The man was talented, but… Jeezus, what a dysfunctional ego.

The US has this habit of raising people up into positions and then feeding their egos to the point where they’re disasters. Most of our generals and admirals are like this–They get so much attention and adulation from the yes-men sycophants they wind up surrounded by that they completely lose touch with reality. Which is why the guys like me, down at the rubber-meets-road level, look up at them in their office suites and go “WTF are you thinking, sir? This ain’t gonna work, no way, no how…”. And, why the disasters we have ensue, despite there having been many people pointing out the lights of the oncoming trains.

Latest deal with people being tracked by their various and sundry GPS apps, revealing military basing and itineraries? Dude, we were pointing at that as a risk factor back in the early 2000s, and nobody did anything about it until it hit the headlines. This is why I’m convinced that we’re either going to have to find a better and more effective way to organize ourselves, or we’re all going to drown in the friggin’ red tape and dysfunction…

It isn’t that the “right” is not “telling their story”, it’s that the other side has been engaged in silencing them for generations, going back to the days of Woodrow Wilson. The fact that he and most of the “progressives” came out of academia ain’t an accident, nor is the mostly Left composition of the academy we have today.

It is all going to come to a grinding halt, anyway, after the ‘eedjit class performs their lobotomy of the STEM portion of the academy. Shortly after, we’ll start to see a return to the pre-credentialism world we had back in the mid-19th Century, where engineers not educated at West Point mostly got their chops through experience and working for other, already-successful engineers. Likewise, with doctors, in all likelihood. The AMA monopoly on training them is one thing that’s going to have to go, if we’re to have the numbers we need, and the affordability to go with it.

You want my honest opinion? We’re about to go through a prolonged paroxysm of change, that’s going to leave the majority of our dysfunctional institutions entirely disintermediated. Why the hell should a kid take on hundreds of thousands of dollars of educational debt, to get a degree they can’t pay the bills with? Why bother, when the information and instructional material is out there for free?

Someone is going to smarten up, and start doing credentials based off of actual accomplishment. Kid runs through all of the Kahn Academy material, takes a test, and bingo-bongo… They’ve done their math requirements for certification in their chosen field. Likewise, with English and other sciences. About the only lingering thing out there, that I see in the future, is the school laboratory. That, you can’t do at home–The rest? LOL… The education industry is in for a shock, when they figure out that what they’re offering is valueless, and that the rubes have cottoned on to that, as well.

Here’s the thing: Much of what we’re doing, ain’t working. We’re also not doing a hell of a lot to try to understand why it ain’t working, and then do anything tangible to fix it.