Comments on: Peter Turchin on the Fall of Rome https://www.isegoria.net/2017/01/peter-turchin-on-the-fall-of-rome/ From the ancient Greek for equality in freedom of speech; an eclectic mix of thoughts, large and small Sun, 31 May 2026 02:04:51 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.6.1 By: Isegoria https://www.isegoria.net/2017/01/peter-turchin-on-the-fall-of-rome/comment-page-1/#comment-2536025 Isegoria Mon, 16 Jan 2017 14:01:06 +0000 http://www.isegoria.net/?p=41331#comment-2536025 Elite overproduction is a problem because the elites aren’t super-productive; rather, they have to split the relatively fixed economic rents into thinner and thinner slices. A civilization with a legal system and lawyers is more productive than one without, but doubling the number of lawyers doesn’t double the gains from having a good legal system.

]]> By: Alrenous https://www.isegoria.net/2017/01/peter-turchin-on-the-fall-of-rome/comment-page-1/#comment-2535943 Alrenous Mon, 16 Jan 2017 05:28:35 +0000 http://www.isegoria.net/?p=41331#comment-2535943 The good emperor raises good feelings for the government, accelerating its cancerous growth. As the host is choked out, the cultural immune system rallies a bit and there’s a remission, but the cancer always rallies in turn and kills the patient.

]]> By: James James https://www.isegoria.net/2017/01/peter-turchin-on-the-fall-of-rome/comment-page-1/#comment-2535813 James James Sun, 15 Jan 2017 15:52:23 +0000 http://www.isegoria.net/?p=41331#comment-2535813 If “elite overproduction” is a problem, what to do about it? I always thought the production of dullards in “Brave New World” was a mistake — if you can make everyone a genius, why wouldn’t you? — but it seems Turchin and Huxley agree. It was certainly a shame the Germans went to war against the other Europeans in 1939, instead of invading somewhere else, but that’s the nature of evolution. There are organisms fighting against their close relatives everywhere.

Elite overproduction may well be a problem, but the alternative is worse. Stupid people are less able to cooperate, and the more you have of them, the worse your society performs.

]]> By: Harper's Notes https://www.isegoria.net/2017/01/peter-turchin-on-the-fall-of-rome/comment-page-1/#comment-2535781 Harper's Notes Sun, 15 Jan 2017 13:04:17 +0000 http://www.isegoria.net/?p=41331#comment-2535781 Memory’s two decades old and so a bit hazy, but I recall in the book Plagues and Peoples some attribution of the fall is given to two major plagues, around 155–180 and then another around 250 very roughly, as greatly de-populating Rome the city. As always with history, reverse causality issues abound.

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